This just in

Anthony · Post by **Anthony** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 12:18 am

James Dennis lied.

Oh wait... I already knew that...

Well now I have nice proof (maybe he will unban me now?).

DeadAIM does NOT work with the new AIM beta... Kinda odd for a person that directly works with that client for the company don't you think?

It is pretty obvious (sorry I use that word to much) that AOL doesn't like what JDennis is doing and worked around their ad remover...

Axilla · Post by **Axilla** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 1:11 am

4.1 wasn't made to work with the new beta...

Master Jedi · Post by **Master Jedi** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 3:25 am

however, if JDennis were collaborating with AOL, why would AOL be working against them?

Axilla · Post by **Axilla** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 3:59 am

Right now, no addon fully works with the new beta.

Some people have different views, but I think logging, cloning (that works, linked screennames is crap), ad removal, tabbed IM windows, and buddy aliasing, are the five most essential features to an AIM addon. Right now, I use the old 5.5 beta and DeadAIM works great for me with that. If something better that does all that comes along that supports the new beta, I won't hesistate to use that.

But since nothing, in fact, works with the new beta, I think we should save our claims about who lied and who works for who until something comes out that does. Notice I'm no longer denying Phase's claim that Jim lied (nor am I agreeing with it, yet).

Anthony · Post by **Anthony** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 7:42 am

AOL would NOT make DeadAIM not work with AIM in ANY respect if Jim worked for him... And if they HAD to (which there is no logical reason that they would have to break the Ad on clients again (seeing as the m_m ad remover does indeed still remove the ad)).

I honestly don't think AOL cares about AIM add-ons other then them taking out their ad. In fact they seem to be embracing these developers, ever since the new layout of AIM.com

This is not to say they support everyone but they sure do support someone. Perhaps AIM allowed Jim (for a fee) access to special parts of AIM that are harder to touch?

Also under further thought I do not dispute Jim working for AOL, as I'm pretty sure that's all he claims. I do however dispute what he is pushing for with out saying - That he works with AIM and has implanted features on AIM, and has special access.

Axilla · Post by **Axilla** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 8:15 am

PhaseDMA wrote:AOL would NOT make DeadAIM not work with AIM in ANY respect if Jim worked for him

Question-begging assumption.

PhaseDMA wrote:Perhaps AIM allowed Jim (for a fee) access to special parts of AIM that are harder to touch?

Take out "for a fee" and I'd probably agree with you on that.

Anthony · Post by **Anthony** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 9:35 am

Axilla wrote:
PhaseDMA wrote:AOL would NOT make DeadAIM not work with AIM in ANY respect if Jim worked for him
Question-begging assumption.

Perhaps, but... I have been right so far... Well there is nothing to prove me wrong at least.

PhaseDMA wrote:Perhaps AIM allowed Jim (for a fee) access to special parts of AIM that are harder to touch?

Take out "for a fee" and I'd probably agree with you on that.[/quote]

Well I don't know how the AIM does the developer thing, and don't much care, but I was saying he went through AIM (just as anyone else can) to be a "developer".

harra · Post by **harra** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 9:55 am

Being that I'm in the software business and my company has many partnerships with software vendors that we do custom work with (some are heavy modifications and add-ins) I can tell you that unless Jim has been picked up on AOL's payroll, he is most likely paying a fee of some sort for the ability to "see" all areas of AIM and not be in violation of some kind of EULA. He and his other "employees" have signed NDA's (Non-Disclosure Agreements) barring them from talking about anything that isn't public knowledge. Special priviledges with a non-Public SDK don't come free and there is a lot of beurocratic red-tape associated with it. But it sure is cool to have that special access

Also, having been involved in collaborative ventures before, the partner is "in the know" about things that will break their add-in, snap-in, etc. He should've had a really advanced peek at the new version of AIM and knew a long time ago the app was going to have some compatibility issues. Then, if you can't update before release, then notify the users. Since this is a Beta release, Jim may be taking the stance that his app isn't guaranteed to function with non-Final releases. He has that right and he doesn't have to answer to his detractors....at least until it doesn't work with the final release

I don't hate Jim or his business practices. There are all kinds of ways to run a business. From Saintly to the Enron Style (aka Stockholders and platinum parachutes are all the count). The ultimate barometer of a successful business is longevity. As M$ has proven, you don't have to be nice to your customers to be successful, you just have to dominate the market

Anthony · Post by **Anthony** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 10:05 am

harra wrote:As M$ has proven, you don't have to be nice to your customers to be successful, you just have to dominate the market

Ya, but you can't much do this if you have people eating away at your heels... M$ until very recently didn't really have this problem, and by the time they did they had so much money that they could "easily" deal with it.

harra · Post by **harra** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 10:45 am

In the Add-in game, word-of-mouth is everything. If you have the best add-in on the market, yet nobody knows about you, you aren't going to provide much competition to the current market leader. Plus, consumers are hard to sway. You can throw a lot of good features into a sound product and you will still have a hard time convincing people to leave a crappy product. Once again look at Windows and Linux (or OS X). Many would argue that Linux (or OSX) is a far superior OS than Windows, but you don't have customers leaving in droves. Why? People are resistant to change. Why do people stay in a crappy job, or a crappy relationship? Because they are often more comfortable with a crappy situation they are familiar with than taking the chance of moving on to a new, unknown crappy situation.

So what does all my rambling mean. DeadAIM really doesn't have much competition nipping at its heals.....yet. What we need to do (those who don't like DeadAIM or how it's business is run) is find a superior product (a subjective opinion) and pimp it likes it going out of style.

Anthony · Post by **Anthony** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 11:54 am

harra wrote:So what does all my rambling mean. DeadAIM really doesn't have much competition nipping at its heals.....yet. What we need to do (those who don't like DeadAIM or how it's business is run) is find a superior product (a subjective opinion) and pimp it likes it going out of style.

Which isn't very hard. I have many people using AIM+ right now, and granted that took a while to get them to use, but m_m currently IS better. It lacks one feature. At the same time that one feature will be part of it sooner then later. Then you have features that no other add-on has that it currently has... Add features that should be in before the year is out, and you have a really good reason to leave.

I think more then enough people use m_m, and amoung those people (and I'm sorry for being modest) can sway others. When you have modertors (3 currently) of one product and their saying use this other product it has to hit home... Especially when those people have never before supported any other product... Going (in my case) from a person that attacks something for every single flaw, then to something then I have no complaints about... That I would think says a lot.

The middle_man forums currently have almost 200 members... That's at least 200 people that use the software. Far more use it though I'm sure. It was released in Aug...

I could argue all day in support of middle_man but you get the point, and anything more would just be me repeating things so...

DeadAIM... A piece of software that has been dying for months...
Middle_Man... A piece of software that is quickly growing...
You do the math.

Master Jedi · Post by **Master Jedi** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 3:49 pm

I have yet to operate a computer on which m_m works...It has successfully installed many times, but the application never runs. I've tried it now on 6 computers. I am by no means a novice computer user. I would say there's probably something about the software I run or way I configure my computer that makes it not work. All I know is it doesn't work for me.

Anthony · Post by **Anthony** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 5:16 pm

Foward your ports

Master Jedi · Post by **Master Jedi** » Thu Dec 11, 2003 7:58 pm

<-- not stupid

The executable doesn't execute. The process starts and stops within a second.

Robpol86 · Post by **Robpol86** » Fri Dec 12, 2003 12:03 am

restart ur computer

if that wont work, format and reinstall

Big-O Software

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